Grants Sub-Committee - Monday 5 February 2024, 7:00pm - Wandsworth Council Webcasting

Grants Sub-Committee
Monday, 5th February 2024 at 7:00pm 

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welcome to this meeting, my name is Councillor Jeremy An Bash, and I am the Chair of the Goran subcommittee.
members of the Committee, I will now call your names in alphabetical order, please switch on your microphone and confirm your attendance Councillor Sheila Boswell.
Councillor Sheila Boswell, present Councillor Claire Gilbert, Deputy Chair, President, good evening everyone, Councillor Angela Graham present, Councillor Daniel Hamilton, at present, leading Councillor Lindsay Hedges.
present and good evening, everyone, Councillors, similar Väth, forethought, present good evening.
and Councillor Stephen moral presence good, we're all here, so we haven't received any apologies.
we have a number of officers presence who will introduce themselves as they address the Committee.
the first item is declarations of interest, are there any declarations of either pecuniary or other registrable or non registrable interests?
there were no declarations of interests.
9
item 2
minutes of the 29th of November, does the committee agree the minutes of the previous meeting, held on 29th November can be signed as a correct record?
greed of scientists at the end of the meeting.
so before we go on to the for grant funds item 3 for 5 and 6, I just wanted to say a few words of introduction and because there are 68 grant applications to consider that's a good thing in some ways, because we've encouraged community groups to make application but it gives us quite a challenge this evening.
and the guillotine falls after three hours at 10.00, so I've suggested to the committee that, where there is a consensus on either awarding a grant or not warding a grant, we move quickly to a vote and we only discuss and debate the issues that are where there's less less consensus or maybe different views.
also, I'm assuming that we will accept the conditions that officers have put in the report are Nest members of the Committee.
raised otherwise.
so with so many applications we're gonna need to work quite quickly to get through and hopefully spend time on the applications that we need to scrutinise in a bit more depth, yes, Councillor Hedges, I knew you were going to say something at this stage.
thank you Chair, yes, I just wanted to.
make a comment, really, in regard to the the volume of the applications that we are being asked to review this evening. It's good governance, in terms of a scrutiny, to be able to have to be able to have time to go through the applications to to scrutinise correctly and all of us, as are all of us as Councillors here, should be given that opportunity. So I guess my concern is that the more applications we have, I mean this is the largest ever I've seen
in nearly the year that I've been on this committee, I think that it's not gonna be, we're going against democracy, so is there any way we can avoid this going forward, ask Conservative Councillors are more than happy to have another meeting so that we can carry out scrutiny in the correct manner if that is something that you would be open to please.
discussing and reviewing at the end of the year whether we've got the number of committees appropriately placed throughout the year, because the last committee we didn't have such a big volume, but I wondered if Mr Evans wanted to say.
and the thing about that.
thank you Chair, and I think we've gotten, we have got an unusual meeting, there's no no doubt about that, because we have got coinciding several strands of grand fund, which I don't think we've had coercive before, but I think it just is the nature of the grant, which won an award and the sort of getting the money out or as quickly as possible, support the groups who want to support. So there's all the balancing act. I think, as we look forward through the next for the coming year, I don't think we're gonna get a re a reoccurring, so that's all coinciding and we have. We are aiming to put enough grand committees to
deal with the business appropriately, I think so obviously you can be the judge of that, but that's what our intention is, so we do accept that there is a loss of this meeting.
is that OK, Councillor Hedges, yes, thank you for that and I really do appreciate it, as long as I think we can just keep it under review, because obviously we have for this particular committee we have essentially four pots of grants that we are all we are essentially looking at, I know one is annual, but there's still a lot more that this committee is now reviewing in the past 12 months thank you.
Councillor Gilbert, did you want to?
well, I suppose it's just really on the on the points about democracy, because I'd hate anyone who's watching or watches this committee at some point on recording to think that the members haven't read all the papers or yeah, I think in some ways this is a bit maybe akin to what happens on planning, which is that you know your planning very well. This is a small deck of papers compared to planning, and we do read everything, but the discussions that we have are of particular matters that we agree to discuss, so I do if it is worth re confirming that certainly my approaches it. We read every application, but we only discussed some, but that doesn't mean they've not been given due consideration.
pledged my point of view, cheering I do want to push us through the agenda, but I don't want to inhibit any Member raising a critical issue in relation to any application, I hope we get through in reasonable time without using the guillotine.
I I suggest we move on to Item 3 on the agenda the Council capacity Grant we've got MD Mrs. Sarah O'Donnell on the
any electronic stop you there and they said OK, we will introduce the paper 24 37 please yeah, so the cultural capacity grant is an annual single award of 10,000 pounds to a small Wandsworth based cultural organisation, to help it to help the organisation develop its capacity and or to pilot something new, so this year we received eight applications, although one of the applications was from an organisation official based in Lamba,
those applications were independently scored by two Council officers who graded the five areas.
that we stated in the application form out of five, so with 0 being the lowest they could score and 5 being the highest in each of the areas, so the five areas we asked applicants to
focus on or that we'd be scoring them on is one the ambition of the applicants proposal to the need or demand for their work, 3, the local benefit of their work for the value for money and 5, the ability of them to deliver their proposal.
so of the eight applications we received black heroes Foundation, applicant application scored the highest one is the one we're recommending. As you can see, by Appendix 1, it scored a significantly higher than the other applications are black. Heroes Foundation have already secured some pro bono support, from the Cranfield Trust, to explore income generation, strategies focusing on digital fundraising, the delivery of corporate workshops and events and developing merchandise and the ones with cultural capacity fund will provide them with the resources they need to actually fully take advantage of this pro bono Cranfield Trust support
and let them implement the strategies,
that are developed through that work, black heroes Foundation have been based in the borough for seven years now, and this investment in the culture through a cultural capacity rent, will give them the opportunity to involve to evolve from being a purely volunteer led organisation that is reliant on individual project funding to become more financially robust organisation going forward and continuing to deliver great projects in Wandsworth.
any questions Councillor houses.
and this was already shouldn't be a surprise, thank you, Chair, I was just asked I asked the question earlier actually.
to the Chair and officers should be aware of this, and just to say thank you very much for all the hard work that you've done on, this really do appreciate it, it's just, could you give us a bit more insight into the scoring methodology so that we know where these numbers come from? Thank you, yeah. So within the the grant application.
we outline that, as I said, that there are five areas that we want them to articulate as part of their application, though their ambition, how they've identified the need and demand for their work.
what the local benefit will be, the value for money and the ability to deliver their plans, and because these are organisations, their small organisations, that we already know pretty well and have worked with indifferent capacity, so myself, and Caroline Simonsen in my team, went through each of those applications and scored against each of those areas out of five.
and came to aren't scores of a maximum of 25 and then combined those scores.
give the scoring.
Greg Heroes, our motion came significantly above the scores elsewhere, yes, yes, Councillor.
a reading in the committee report.
at paragraph 14, it's very interesting that the the they'll be working out of their volunteers' house, which is amazing really as unless I'm reading it wrong.
has that been looked at as regards to support?
Mr Donald and other comments on working out of their homes, they've been doing that up until now, haven't they well, they they weren't, and I think it actually came up in the last committee so there used to be based in the scratch hub at Battersea Arts Centre.
but when that closed in April,
2023 they've been, there'd been homeless, as it were, so they've been working out at the volunteers homes since then.
we are continuing to work with them in trying to find a new location for them to to be based at, and that is the ideal scenario, and again this is in part why they're looking at developing the secure income because, while they're reliant on grant funding, they are able to fund it when they've gotten awards.
to pay rent somewhere, but at other times they would not be able to afford to to pay the rent, whereas if they can get some kind of constant income stream that will give them better security. Councillor Gilbert, did you want sorry we've indicating on say No, we were happy to go with the recommendation black heroes Foundation award for the year yeah thank you very much.
thank you, Mr wrong, we're only number 4, which is the Borough of Sanctuary Community Fund, and we got Ms Helena McGinty, the head of refugee services, with us, to introduce that report 24 38.
thank you very much Chair.
the Borough of Sanctuary Community Fund was established in April 2023.
it forms part of the Council's aim to become a Borough of Sanctuary in the fund is to support voluntary sector organisations to deliver projects which help those seeking sanctuary to feel welcome and supported in the borough
the fund was set up with an initial 200,000 pounds, and a total of 66,304 pounds has been awarded in the first and second rounds, which leaves 1 133,686 pounds remaining in the fund as part of this third round, 6 bids were received for a combined total of 51,000 officers, have reviewed and scored the applications which have been used to inform summaries and recommendations included in this report.
we are recommending the funding be awarded to fee organisations with a combined total of 21,880 pounds and 2 Pen.
the fund has four priority themes of community integration support, meaning are they helping new and recent refugees and asylum seekers who have arrived in the Barretts, integrate into life in the UK and the local community?
the second priority is wellbeing supporting activities which promote refugees and asylum seekers wellbeing, the third is expanding organisational capacity, supporting initiatives that build the capacity of the voluntary and community sector to deliver support to asylum seekers and refugees and finally celebrating refugees and asylum seekers projects which promote the contribution that refugees and asylum seekers nearer to the borough, so that is a brief intro and I will hand back to the Chair.
we're just dealing with the committee paper will go through each of the six applications in the second, but I know Councillor Varatharajah wanted to say, a word is that the boroughs refugee champion
thank you Chair, and thank you all enough for your report, I just wanted to say I do agree with the recommendations officers have made on all of these applications.
I believe two of the applications where the organisations are actually based outside of Wandsworth and in the application they weren't able to kind of identify the need for it, but from speaking with refugees and that organisations within Wandsworth, I do believe there is a need for one of the applications was for an Esau class and the other was a bike project, so I was just wondering, if us as I'm using them, a one-off migration forum, can we encourage more organisations within ones were to apply for the fund, because there's only been six applications that have come forward and just kind of to be able to kind of use. The projects and themes that have been applied to say, sorry, the organisations that have applied can use those themes, but we're going to use them here who have been once we've opened
see if we can encourage more applications come forward and I might help the refugees with those needs, sorry, it has a bit more readily yeah, and has begun to any comment on that, the organisations that are not ones worth buying we we may not be supporting tonight but there may be a local need, How can we further that discussion?
yes, I think the migration forum would be an excellent vehicle for that, so we'll definitely added to the agenda for the next meeting thanks, Councillor Brett crash.
any other comments on the reintroduction. Yes, Councillor Hamilton, thank you, judge, touch it. It does touch actually on two of the applications, but I wanted to make a general general points, particularly look at the the terms of reference for how you apply to these funds at first being the community integration support, the second being wellbeing. I'm particularly glad to see two applications this evening from organisations that do promote the the learning of English language and communities, because I think one of the biggest failings we've seen from successive governments, my own and from Labour as well was a situation where you had asylum seekers living in the UK who were not given the support that they need properly to learn the language to be able to gain qualifications, get jobs and build successful lives here and were instead kept only in their communities rather than being part of the broader community. So I think it's great to see those applications and it's good to see the fund working in the way that it was intended
good, I think there's lots of agreement around the table, Councillor Hamilton, on that, let's move on to the applications and to consider them one at a time, so there's the Bike Project, the first one which is not recommended.
the Committee in agreement.
and then we are.
breaking barriers to integration to ones with refugees is not not recommended
again, because it's not in within the borrowers, I understand it, yeah people in agreement.
OK.
the next one he saw on the move, English reaction, it is re recommended.
we were walking in and and language.
year.
in agreement.
the fourth one is home community care cafe, which is recommended.
yes, so I thought you might want to speak on that, I know, Meg I think, she's amazing out yeah I love the initiatives, it's been created here and it looks as if they are going to be taking over the cafe, cooking and stuff like that my question is being ran a restaurant that you actually have to have.
knowledge of cleanliness and health, and I know that.
the Council used to do this. I don't know whether they do it now, but it would be great if those people who were having this experience could get a certificate because if they were to apply for a job somewhere else, that would have the evidence that they they, they'd gone through the stamp of Wandsworth and I think that might add and enrich what Legg is doing. I don't know feedback from the officers. Perhaps Councillor Graham, thank thank you for that. Yeah must begin to. Would you like to comment on
once were certificate for health and safety cleanliness, thank you, and so.
a skills course where food hygiene is offered as part of the training, so we were happy to see that that was covered off.
Councillor Graham, would that be with the Council because then they would have a certificate of high hygiene which would assist, or would they go through a test with someone professional so that they would receive an agreed level of hygiene so that they can actually go into different food sources?
my God.
my understanding is that the current certificate holder that will be doing the training, but I think that's a great idea that the person could then hold a certificate in their own right if they have access to that, so we can definitely add that you know you can follow that up yeah yeah, Councillor warmth and distribute you can actually do level 2 and 11 3 certification online, its registered certificate that you get my organisation has people going through its
there is that option as well.
yeah
Will you follow that up in consultation with the community cafe yeah, members who were in are in agreement with the recommendation to to find yer? Thank you.
Mercy Foundation is sofa British life not not recommended.
Lima, Green yeah.
you see of St Michael's and St Stephen's Church is recommended yeah.
OK.
I think we've agreed the three of the officers have recommended, thank thank you very much, Ms McGinty, for joining the meeting, thank you Chair, thank you.
now, overall, we've done two of the grant funds, we respondents for the the bigger volume.
I think Ms Deol is going to introduce paper 24 39 cost of living grant fund.
thank you Chair. So this is the second round to the cost of living grant funds. We had a previous round late last year, so groups could apply for between two and a half thousand and 20,000 pounds for projects that provided community spaces, access to food or supported the voluntary sector to provide other services in response to the cost of living. For this, grant fund officers were looking for projects that were in direct relation to cost of living, not just a lot of general projects that had a cost of living flavour or you know didn't describe the need adequately within the application. Within this we have cross referenced against the other funds because we were. There was a 20,000 pound cap that groups couldn't apply for the same project across two grant funds and we were looking for projects that obviously met the clear criteria, but there were some that offered food as a sort of add-on to the project, which which felt inconsistent with the approach or which considered sort of meeting inside as being a community space. Whereas we felt that wasn't sort of fully address, addressing the
the priority area.
so we had 23 applications and were recommending 10 projects,
good any questions from the studio Councillor Hedges, and then Councillor Boswell, thank you Chair minds more of a general comment on the form, so thank you for everything you do, it's just I remember asking last time could we have a section here stating what the previous funding was and I see that's on there, but I just wondered if we could add the the pound amount as well just so that we can see how much each wanna get each
if we get a reoccurring one so very similar vein to what we do for the Wandsworth grant fund, please just a small request and I thank you, thank you.
that will be taken on in future year. Councillor Boswell, yes, thank you very much on all of you, for for all of the work on this on mine was a kind of general comment as well around actually Councillor endorsements, and I had a particular question that I wanted to ask here, because if you look at the waiting on at the back, you know the Councillor endorsement is it's extremely important than it actually says that the application doesn't go through without it. However, I've noticed that some councillors have really you can see scrutinise, they know these projects, they've written reams, analyzed and others will just put a couple of sentences on, and that's on both sides we all do it, but that isn't really my point. My point is, how much weight does that really have because it doesn't seem to make any difference? You've got councillors who who have written reams, and it's rejected and councillors who return one sentence and it's accepted, so I am kind of struggling with what that is and trying to add to the scrutiny here by Boswell, I think you're making the point about the next, with the ones was grant fund rather low cost of living Bow. Many members were, and we have to take that when we deal with that report, but I think anyone Isaac is that correct? Mr you, yeah
this fund we didn't have Councillor Dawe know, you're part of this fund just because of the timescales for applicants to apply, but if you could answer, will I go to the next one boy, forgive me?
ready for that, okay,
is there any reason why we don't have Councillor endorsements for these ones, sorry to steal it was it was due to the timescales of applicants applying to the fund, we we felt there wasn't time for them to go out and get that endorsement.
OK any any other questions on the Committee report
OK, let's move through the.
individual applications, so.
ergo empowerment Network limited is not recommended.
people in agreement.
yeah
no, I think he was.
agreement.
the number 2 is.
begin to sports group academy recommended at a reduced rate, and would the officer like to explain them why it reduced rate yesterday there were two parts of the project, one was an elders social club and one was the children's homework club and it was felt that the the children's homework club was of lower priority for the fund overall and therefore the funding was
was the funding in the budget towards the the elderly Club and then a proportion of the additional information or additional?
budget lines, they wanted towards insurance and training, and things like that, thank you, ma steal, yeah, Councillor Warrell, just a quick question of clarification.
on the application of the condition of the Ward refers to an asset lock, which I don't fully understand what that actually means in terms of the application OK, Mr maggots, gonna do.
thank you, thank Councillor. Yes, one of the things we were checking within organisations still for the CFCs, with their articles, is that they should have an asset lock and, in the the case, will begin to sport. Actually there are the asset lock is actually wrong and it is actually the way they've done, it's just not allowed, but it's something we can go back to them as a condition so that they can rectify that no internally before they come back to us, but they do we have set out. Currently, it is actually not allowed
that is something we can pick up with and discuss with them tomorrow, so being stupid here.
I don't fully understand what an asset lock is in this conviction. Thank you guys, I'm sure you're not the only one, okay and so the the they're that they're set up as are at a CEC or a community interest company, and as part of that legislation, that if the organisation was to close or to dissolve in some way the, because the there's that, I've I add a community, a social aspect to the organisation that the assets that would remain, they have to pass on to another not community type organisation that saw that assets are then locked so they can take them back. Personally, as I've maybe a private company, would Councillor Andy Hatch in their articles? They have to name who that would be or allow. The regulator noted to distribute these those assets themselves, so it depends on which version of the articles have used as well as visual slate models,
but actually in the way that the the the they have described the the asset lock is actually themselves, and that's not allowed back, thank you, Mr Murdoch yeah, yes, Councillor Gilbert.
just to say I I did wonder on this when whether the fact that Councillors don't endorse and asked to endorse these applications meant that there's maybe a gap of information, but then again I do know sometimes you get there you get the request very close to the deadline, but you know a local councillor in Roehampton could definitely have helped with this one I feel just knowing that there is such significant. You know food poverty, and I I just think there would be a queue round the block for this service, but then I and I do recognise we have papers later on that are serving some of the need in Roehampton, so it's it's just a sort of reflection really on on what you miss. Sometimes if you don't have Councillor endorsements by totally take the point about timing, and I hope that this this group will be successful and they'll do some work in Roehampton at some point in the future. Thanks to Councillor Councillor Bureau Councillor Hamilton, thank you. Just an observation one reveals. I think this is the
third meeting, where there's been a an application, will just come from the Dorrington that hasn't been fully and either approved, or hasn't been fully in line with the the terms of reference for funds and applications. Now I don't think there's any sort of sort of golden thread that runs through the applications who are applying or whether there just needs to be a particular informal uptick education piece done amongst groups on on those estates, but I've seen this a few times now there and some outreach from from officers to
community groups there might be useful in terms of framing these reports going forward, and clearly Councillor Gilbert has mentioned that working with councillors may be one way to do that. I've just noticed a couple of times now. I'm not sure officers will will bear that in mind in their outreach and support. So are we in agreement with no number 2 reduced rates, so they are held a social club is supported yet as recommended yeah
now we're under number 3 Corona kids see, I see.
I think Councillor Hedges, I know you wanted to say something and then Councillor Boswell.
thank you Chair just a quick one, because this looks like a really great initiative, and we don't often see applications come through where we're helping we're helping with the ones with prison families, so I understand this was rejected on the basis that it's covered.
there's already.
sorry, sorry, it's already covered under the range of HF activities.
do you provide any guidance to this particular applicant, or will you provide any guidance to this applicant on how they can?
get involved or partner with the HF projects and activities that are already out there, so I'm just trying to remember what HF stands for.
that's it.
holiday activities must still do on to yes, so so definitely we can we can link this organisation with the the team that oversees the they have funding and and see if there's any or activities that they can in town Lincoln with the beneficiaries of the project so that they can take part at nos over the summer and holidays.
Councillor Boswell, yes, I actually was I I had the same question so I won't double up but yeah it's the holiday activities, food programme that's run through children's services.
we were going with the recommendation not to support this application at this stage yeah.
thank you.
so were Dodington and Rolo Association.
whose?
this eight organisations involved and it is not recommended by officers.
we're onto a Estate Arts.
and it's not recommended.
by officers.
agreed, thank you.
with family action not recommended.
my officers agreed.
number 7.
junction community management not recommended by officers greed.
junction Community Trust, which is ones with food bank, is recommended by officers.
agreed.
little village number 9 not recommended by officers.
please please, thank you.
living truth recommended by officers.
is there agreement from the Committee, thank you.
number 11 is Linwood, Christian Fellowship, not recommended by officers.
greed?
mother and child welfare organisation is number 12 not recommended by officers.
muscular Sam number 13 is recommended by officers.
agreed.
14 Nova ha UK not recommended.
by officers.
fraud.
PCC St Michael's and St Stephen's Church recommended by officers.
greed?
yeah, you're very pure absolutely on on on the money that's reduced somewhat is that Zara reason for that and steel, or Mr Murdoch?
I think the addition was wrong.
no, I come out because I think it was one to one, so I think I think there are they had been addition was wrong to the mountain, you applied, once they went back to my checked at a slightly different that was that was all yes.
yeah
18 4 5 7 4 7 5
yeah
thank you, so we're answer 16 positive network community project recommended that the reduced amount.
greed?
rackets, cubes number 17
recommended.
greed?
number 18, sound minds not recommended.
sorry.
yet nowadays.
going too quickly.
OK, 18, sound minds.
not recommended here.
sport for Health, I think Councillor Warrell, you wanted to raise.
because at the just the reduction, yes no, we.
I clarify with the officers the reduction because they should do their own monitoring and evaluation, so there's 300 was taken off, we are we in agreement with.
brought for Health CSA
storm families centre recommended slightly reduced amount.
yes, Councillor Warrell.
you just a couple of points for clarification on this application storm is one of the major organisations on the Dodington estate and actually provide services to a large number of people I'm looking at this application, can we ensure that these are actually new people coming through rather than just the existing clientele that use the storm?
and also storm does host other organisations actually using their premises and works in partnership. I just want to make sure that, within the counting of the numbers that if it's a host organisation stormed a full claimant as their own, rather than and actually gives true and allows the other organisations to claim those numbers as their own as as there is people using the service doesn't get to get mixed up, so just a points for something to actually look when the monitoring comes through, just something to look at new clients and not double counting. Yes, Minister, you yeah, that's been noted well, yeah, OK, thank you
first-down projects, this one's not recommended.
20 to
bin yard, church 61, recommended re produced.
amount.
23 is Wimbledon, Simon synagogue not recommended.
agreed.
OK.

6 Wandsworth Grant Fund, Round 25 (Paper No. 24-40)

which is Wandsworth ground fund round 25 and Mr Murdoch is going to introduce it for us, thank you, thank you, Chair, sorry, welcome members for the Doha round, 25 or salt grant fund for this for this year and not on the fund.
so we add we received 31 eligible applications are requesting 238,517 and and, after assessment we were making officer per meeting recommendations of 95,322 no, I just want to do to our members to note a couple of paragraphs of paragraphs 7 and 8 which relate to the the budget for this year so,
members are aware of, I've hesitate it, it has been in the two earlier rounds of the year and through our allocation, where we spent slightly more than some of the medium.
but then during the year for
for the last round. Probably we had the kitchen equipment, we were brought in 30,000 for the cost of living fund so that helped to boost us, but it does mean that we actually started off know our base budget for for this round just stood at 35 and a half thousand pounds so very, very, very low from we would normally be. However, the Council does have had a separate endowment fund lodged with the London Community Foundation and as an endowment fund that brings in some some annual interest and which we haven't used for for a couple of years. So actually this fund at 35 and a half thousand it's been supplemented by 61,765 from that fund, so the two funds are that to behold are actually very, very similar in terms of the guidance so actually being able to through a third or a deed which we have with the London Community Foundation to to bring those two funds together. So it does give us our fund available just of 95,268, so you can see from the with a recommendation of 95,000 no, but we're very tight within the budget, so I've had to do quite a lot of work wow within our assessments to
not necessarily that we wanted to spend all the money, it was just that the way, the bulk of what things out and and actually with we took all the recommendations that the officers wanted to initially, we would create in excess of that, so we had to do some correct negotiation and work with other officers and look quite tightly at the applications that we had before it, so it has been quite quite a difficult round for it for us to try to manage everything that's been said.
thank you, Mr Murdoch yeah Councillor Ross already, did you want to just yeah give that question again, yes, we will, I'll say it's all right, yeah, I was so keen to him to ask it I mean, do you want me to recap or did you you got the gist of and I thank you?
yes, that's about about the the Councillor endorsements,
you are as as as you stated no earlier than the the.
I think trying to for organisations and
there's struggled themselves to just fill in the application form to get a Councillor endorsement is that the defined quite difficult and I will be do leave the fact to talk to yourselves early is usually as good as anything it's always last minute but that the the quality of the of the overtly endorsements I'd use as you stated earlier not various tremendously,
within that I, I would say in terms of when, as officers are assessing them, actually we we try to assess our app the applications not independently from that from that comment, so we're getting the officers' professional assessment towards that and because then we bring the the or the the the Member endorsement to yourselves notice, as I did wait from a different source. So in terms of the officer assessment, but not looking personally well, when we notice and officers do notice nor the amendment to Westminster, they are usually the members, it's it's not there and then we have to do better chasing so in terms of making the officer assessment, it's something we do separately and we bring no w within these papers to you, though you know the officer assessment, together with the Members' endorsement themselves, for you to be able to use not to scrutinise them because judgment for yourselves, so would you have situations where a member's endorsement
would Sueño would check would change, it would be a deal-breaker, not not in terms of the of the officer's recommendation, just itself,
I'm very and disturbed to hear that it's very hard for organisations to get the Councillor endorsement, because that should be the easiest thing for them, and that's obviously something that we all need to be much more alert about with with our own group I mean, obviously all of us who sit on the grants committee and people who have done previously would understand the importance, but if you haven't so, we need to do some work on that. Is there anything that else that we could do from on our side to encourage our councillors to pick up on these? I think if, if people get wind and I know sometimes no organisations come to you very late and we try to encourage them not to do that and we to say to them even before you fill in your application form, you know at least just send R and A or not or a note to local councillors. I think people often don't know or don't know yourselves, you know they come to us and say, Who should I ask and we give them guidance on that, nor whether that's through no, no geographically within your own ward or it might be a Cabinet Member who's gone or another member who's got particular interest in that, but I think it's just it's it's it's another task which they have to do, but no, no, no,
when you're talking to the voluntary organisations in the borough and in your ward, and just under thinking about grant funding, say to them, I'm here to help you know if you need an endorsement, come to me so that one can that positive encouragement would always help. Thank you very much yes, we can all certainly do that and we can push for that. Would it be perhaps that you would automatically just provide on an e-mail for the Councillors on in that ward that it would be automatic, I know it's another task and you're very overworked but,
so that they had just automatically had it to hand and they didn't need to search it out.
I think the
where the an organisation is just walking in one ward, that's defined that easier where they're working, maybe the projects, not across the whole borough or truth, it was wounded, I asked where the struggle was into first-time, that they've done it, or indeed organisations outside the borough are coming as well so we get the whole do the whole range of things.
and one of the things particularly of this round, I mean I did a lot of chasing if somebody put a name in their application form, I didn't have anything I would follow as I've agreed with the members before I have tried to follow up and chase.
no, because I I know, thankfully, you normally respond to me quite quickly, so at least I get get that, so we do our best within the team. Pre-approved people have nothing for nor follow things up and it sort of it's just ones. I think one of the things that happens sometimes is one Member will maybe copy in a couple of colleagues, and people think I've got two or three members endorsement, but actually only one will reply to me and I need something. If there's three not in award, the people said put their names and actually I need something from each councillor rather than just one e-mail saying No, I'm sending this on behalf of no
all my friends, as well as the that doesn't quite know, and nor is it in terms of scrutiny, it doesn't really cover things like.
well as well. Yeah, I'm sorry, I don't want to keep doing a tunefulness, and thank you very much and I know that you're all in incredibly ever worked with is on sale there. On our side, I think that we on both groups, we could certainly make this point to our colleagues and please do chase us if, if you let us know, if you're having particular difficulties or maybe on the committee that and we can chase our colleagues and thank you, yeah wanted to add something on this. I do it's good to have more meat on the bone as regards to a councillor supporting an application and kind of following it through, but ultimately at the end of the day, when it comes to committee, it is a decision of the committee, and sometimes it's quite hard to swallow when you find you haven't got it through, but
it's it's 4 1 to fight and try and get the best, but I do agree that we are not aside.
your Councillor,
within the hedges and and dare Dan that we will look at the same OK, I move anything further on that.
the Committee paper 24 40 yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, you again, yeah, it's para 10 I'm very interesting to see how you really are working hard to get them order, you know done and dusted objector does wonder the as regards to you know the number 20 for left.
and that was kind of nearly two years ago and 0 wow, what are the issues which is really causing the the slow progress of of them, although you're doing a very good job, it would be interesting.
the slow progress of yes, I think what are we talking about, but some of the projects here, so the projections would you see like that in Edinburgh and round 19, there's does one project outstanding which haven't finished I I know which projects it is, I think sometimes what Hammersmith put me in one of the things we
people, often countries with issues very late.
and and and that then becomes an issue I know for what is it you know, and we we, we try to be as flexible as but one of the things that you can do with grants has been is be flexible as much as not. We've got agreements in place and if we know there's an issue, then we can help, sometimes it could be staff that's changed and left and not passed on projects to not, and that's often happened when, when I'm dealing with one project and I think the staff have changed about four times now, so trying to progress some projects, now it takes a long time and we do get to the point. Sometimes we just say look no at the town's dragged on so much actually no doubt that the it we just have to be asked for the money back and one that does happen sometimes yeah so I know I know well and I've got, I've got a number of projects, but it certainly is something that we were continually doing in terms of monitoring and because most projects don't report back until the end of the project, and although we do encourage them and ask them to know if there's an issue to come, tell us beforehand porridge, I think organisations are very frightened that if I say that something has gone wrong, then the funds will take their money away rather than be supportive and help, and we we try to support and help where we can not Britain or draw on other colleagues when, when necessary, I think I would give them advice, but often it's the way that projects you know come to come at the very end and we have to decide not in terms of the value of that project and the work that is doing is that it's something that was continued or ask the money back. So I know the project and in round 10 19 has suffered from no staff rollover with within it and we're working with them, but no were were. We've actually cut up a lot of the projects of bridges I've started just we had a round just before COVID started. No, of course, like I think, but now about four weeks before and we have been dealing with those projects and rolling over
them. So I think we have now cleared that backlog of of things that were, and were certainly catching up, quite a lot with things.
Councillor Hamilton, did you want to ask something on the, I teach the record question, I am just interested wow wow who was the grant applicant in round 23, who didn't take up the grant.
at around 23 I would have to come back to you on that one, actually I can't remember who it is, you know, I can't remember.
OK.
there were 11 recommended out of the 31.
so we go, the first one is Smallwood PR,
just a quick one, sorry, Chair, so if we have a sponsored walk or put our name to one of these Grants, are we able to actually discuss that in this meeting or do we have to stand back or does it not matter yeah yeah, it's Mr Mowat we've heard that one will fall anyway yeah OK, thank you brilliant thanks.
a number 9 number 1 Smallwood Primary active dawns, holiday camps, grant not recommended green agreement.
number 2 age, strong prevention, strength, training for healthy ageing to prevent osteoporosis, I think Councillor Weir, you wanted to ask something, yes, I think this is interesting Grant what worries me is that you mentioned about co-productions in in the notes here.
I would like to see, as maybe some some recommendations back to them is that some evidence of working with the St George's force and Bonehill bone health service, I think that's a good partnership arrangements there see also what arrangements there are in terms of the social prescribing service within the borough I think some linkages there and also Age UK also do some full service and some stuff around strengthening, so if we're talking about co production to support this project and make it even richer than it is as I'd like to see some evidence of some guidance about how they can work with those particular services as well just to improve and improve the quality of the service,
yeah
came the steal J you, you've got those links, yeah yeah, good, and if the grant is recommended, yes, thank you.
there being Charity rise up, the grant is recommended.
yes, Councillor Boswell, yes, I just had a comment on it and it's on Councillor endorsements again, and this is probably a really good example, I know Begbie Charity on wonderful, wonderful charity is very well known and we've funded before, but the primary ward of active activity is Tooting Bec and really pleased to see these coming through now for Tooting instituting Councillor and that is my ward, it's been endorsed by Battersea councillors.
and talks about how Battersea Park Ward is the inner divided demographic this this is the Councillor comments and it isn't even taking place there.
so I don't know whether there's a case for feedback again, it's asking you to do more work, isn't it, but it hasn't even been endorsed both by the right council.
if it is a borough wide project, as I understand, it, is the right model.
yes.
to pick this up, I will fight this question before, ideally, we ask projects to to have our ward councillor located, where the activities taking place, I know that big beans.
used to be up and back to the quiet, have moved on and will ditch yeah, community centre and and Councillors they have to do nor them, and I know officially their office is down and the down in Tooting now so there are bits of split no, so there's no split George means there as well, and so I think in this cases as with with with many applications people go to councillors who they know n and but that's valid within the within the guidance of the for in Council endorsement this is how something has come up before.
OK well, thank you very much, but had they had my name and come to me, I would have been very happy to endorse that sure you'll make contact with them, Councillor Wadsworth, or are we in agreement yeah yeah, thank you very much.
sir number 4 is your health, and you refit and refurbish kitchen that was you, it's not not recommended yes.
sorry, quick one check, this was another classic one that came through really late, so I I did my best to help this this really great initiative actually and I actually think they're in Trinity not actually in Burnham, so presumably they did try to get hold of other Councillors and I was like their last resort but I think they were that I don't think this was the grant that they meant to apply for either.
I think it was more the cost of living, one that they they were going to apply for, but in any case I think this is this is an organisation that really would need to benefit from some help and guidance from you because it's a shame because what they were trying to do when they explained it to me on the phone is actually really good, so I just wondered if there was anything you can do to help them for any future at reapplication, thank you.
and we've actually, I think we've had a version of this application from them before, and I've spoken to them a number of times over over over the years on this, so I know they've been trying to target, I do have issues about their governance.
well which I've tried to help them with, but they don't seem to be taken on board, and that's a quite a big issue with them, no one and and also means when you read the application is spoke about an older pupils' club but the budget belongs to the budget spoke about a kitchen so there was there was quite some disjointed there.
but I mean, I'm I'm I'm more than happy to go back to them and see if I can know and provide them with some further help, to see if they'll listen to the advice that we gave them before, but it says No, Minister yeah, should you be able to yes yeah yeah yeah, so I think I think having Tokyo O2 meeting Councillor before yeah,
we are agreeing not to go ahead with this fund, yeah yeah number.
Black Heroes Foundation number 5, this one's not not recommended.
number 6.
Bolingbroke Trust rebuilding the butterfly garden, I think Councillor Hedges, you wanted to raise something on this
very similar, venter the last question, just what can we do to to help this very good trust in reapplying again next time, thank you.
and I think it was because I, I think you've said in the papers, but I think there's two or three other similar to this in the soft capital projects is that we do have a another fund and with which we thought was more appropriate, and I know that Mike my colleague here Ms Steelers is working on details on that Putin's under serve when information comes out later in the year we can, we can certainly make sure that we pick up those that came through the wonderful grant fund.
and fill in the papers is that correct, because this is quite a large amount of money that they are seeking.
yeah, Councillor Gilbert, I think in terms of precedent as well, we've we've often given this sort of feedback when we've had applications from schools, it's good there's the obvious fact that schools at the centre of the community but we've always I think, asked for something more haven't we in terms of reaching out, so I think it is important to be consistent across the piece, thank you
OK.
so were in agreement not to.
recommend the grant at this stage yet.
care number.
6
once worth mentorship, net work is not recommended.
OK, thank you.
number
8 Wandsworth young people's support scheme is recommended.
yes, Councillor Hamilton, thank you Chair, just as I mentioned to you earlier. I know we often look at these applications and say Can officers go back and give feedback as to help applications get passed in the future when we look at the key South application, I think this is one we have seen before, which we gave that request and it appears to have come back and is recommended for a grant this evening, so thank you to officers for giving that advice. I think it shows that
by working closely with these organisations, they can improve the applications and get them over the line, so thank you for your work on that and fingers crossed some gables we speak about tonight will also be in the same fortunate position in the future.
thank you, Councillor Hamilton, OK.
there were agreed number 8 number 9, his garden share scheme was not recommended.
greed?
number 10 is one for a nutrition programme which is recommended.
Councillor Ward, did you want?
sorry, I've got that wrong, he agreed.
number 11 is the Saturday's studio, chocolate films is recommended.
so something a bit different, getting involved in films, thank you very much.
number 12 diverse youth club, diverse wellbeing and mental health from recommended greed.
early years Forest School Trinity St Mary's not recommended number 13.
agreed.
nourish.
home community cafe,
his recommended yes recommended yeah, thank you Brede.
number 15, Katherine Lowe, Settlement Jamie's Farm residential trip.
recommended Councillor Warrell
thank you Chair.
this is once again, this is an interesting project, I think this is what this is going back to more in my previous comments about co-productions and working in partnership, I think this is one where I'd like to see a greater demonstration in terms of the feedback and the work that's being done, what their links with are with CAMHS for example in supporting the youngsters that have been identified.
greater understanding of how.
these particular young people identified against others who might be presenting as well, what the criteria would be and also then what is the link might be crossed with education services in terms of supporting people with who might be sensing behavioural problems, and so I suppose, whilst her value this project I think projects like this should show a greater demonstration of the integration tis and a wraparound support service for particular vulnerable people.
Mr Murdoch, yeah, we've
Will you follow that up with CAMHS and children, yes, we can certainly discuss that with them, thank you.
thank you.
16
from Little Acorns mighty oaks grow were not recommended, I think Councillor Hedges did you want to say something on this?
similar question to last time, how can we help this organisation reapply next time please?
certainly we can pick this up both with our ops team and considers the t there's arts officers, who've got health and wellbeing theme as well, so certainly we can we can discuss with them and difficult, not much difficulty, some good links with all the artists, and it's something that I'm quite personally so we can certainly follow that up through that route.
would Councillor Hedges' other question where it's at might may overlap with what Age Well bats they do so the work may be the link there might or might be helpful. Yeah, so we can certainly know, and I think this is one just wondered, the issues, a lot of projects, absolutely don't stop or not no scope around to see what other things on him and sometimes don't know what else is going on as well. So this is why there was a comment made by the commissioners. The overlap quite a lot with the Agewell Battle steelworkers going on, but and then in both possibly that we can dovetail them in with that as well, which may be another route
yeah
OK so deny number 16 were agreed not to recommend the grant at this stage, and number 17 has disappeared.
number 18 is sisterhood and well wellness, which is not recommended.
number 19, women's saying a mental wellbeing group which is not recommended.
agreed.
number 20 is action for autism, which is.
recommended.
yes
Councillor Graham, I really do I really do welcome this and again off from other.
Councillor Warren was saying No, you got social services, you've got other.
departments who could really assist with this, and also I'd like to know how you're going to advise these this to these people to a contact between school, has special needs department in a Wu Swaffield.
and also Smallwood, as well, and and other schools because.
there are more and more children, I know parents would love to see activities out.
being normal and being more involved with reality of life.
I think.
talking to both those organisations or other organisations.
we will work in particular with some of the work with children, so we've got a number of organisations who are working with children with autism, bottle families as well. I think it's through it through their networks because they don't that's where the network seemed to be a battle between between the two parents. Also, we can not share this with, although this has come through some of the the public health team actually sharing with children's services and through those links as well, we will try and scope out is quite as it moves, it is actually say, is becoming a much larger no more and more children have been been diagnosed
but I think no, and I've probably got not four or five organisations working with them, some who worked closely together and others, I know this organisations has done a few small projects in the borough and it is starting to do more, but it's something we, I think know through other colleagues and in the Sutherland Disability area field we will be who have good connections with.
we can help them to build their networks up.
thank you, Mr Murdoch, OK, we're agreeing number 20.
21 lens sound in nature, not recommended greed.
for 22 pure football not recommended.
23 grow Ampton Chicken Project not recommended.
greed?
24 is Roehampton table tennis club not recommended.
yes, Councillor Boswell, you wanted to say something on the year, so I just had an.
comment on it,
I wanted to ask, because when you look in the guidance, obviously, projects that are or applications that reflect priorities on in all our different departments and the priorities of the administration that gives them more weight, and this is bringing or using a club room.
and the community club rooms, particularly in the estates, is something that we have really really keen to bring back into use the lot of them were muffled, dear it down to austerity and we've just actually hired a or a manager to that will be their role to look at that so this,
makes use of or a club room, and I I wondered I mean, I'm sure everybody their favourite theme, they'll be asking if that can be recognised in the guidance, but I was wondering how how that's done, how something like that could be included.
sorry, I'm you it is certainly something we're aware of through patronage through our cost of living work, we're whereas, but whereas one of the things that were really encouraged, so it's something we're very much aware of and I've known about this group for about a year or so it's very small but I think you know it would have been I think it was one of the projects that officers would have liked to have supported them and just in principle in terms of the detail.
and with the application no came to us to me, it looked to somebody who is often not very experienced one in table tennis and obviously because you have very high levels individually and but maybe not lacks that skill and experience of putting in grant applications but I know talking to officers working in the area both in housing and in other areas know they are aware and and and they have offered to help.
for future. So assuming our prejudices when we can come, we can do somewhat less encouraging, come back through that's really good news, so you've actually done that already, yes, excellent, thank you. Thank you, Mr Murdoch. So we're agreed not to recommend at this stage it might be one in the light mist. Councillor Hamilton was saying that we would come back to you in the future good. There were 25 films of artists working practice from Sprout Arts. It's not recommended
thank you.
26 Furzedown project ageing on your own terms, older LG P, G B B T people planning together to thrive in old age, which is recommended.
agreed.
27 help the helpers Wandsworth Oasis is not recommended.
greed?
thank you.
28 memoirs Wandsworth older People's Forum not recommended.
thank you.
29
increasing access at.
world's heartbeats embassy Gardens, Councillor Hedges, did you want to say something on this one?
no, OK this, this is not not recommended, yeah gout know why, Mr what, Councillor Warren?
thank you Chair this application returns to a theme that I brought up before unless organisations with huge incomes making or making applications to us.
against small organisations. I look at the annual income coming in over KVA and expenditure that leaves 2.3 million each year in terms of the income and expenditure differential. This is capital, this is a capital project as well. In the report it says right at the very end, on page 2 7 5, the application is not recommended, but there's a view to potentially resubmitting through future round. I would go against this recommendation. I think, whilst I respect this organisation a lot, this is a classic organisation that has huge amounts of income coming in huge amounts and they can actually funds something this small from within their own, from their own spend as against an organisation that has a tiny amount of money and they tried to actually do a lot. So I would ask the officers to reconsider that recommendation, and also I think it's something we need to start debating about. It is what's the amount of income an organisation might have to make an application
for for a limited pot of money and say you,
Mr Murdoch, why you are happy to re.
rethink to any other committee. Members want to make a coffee or Councillor Hamilton, thank you, but I have I have actually significant sympathy for what Councillor Wall says about large, very large organisations, particularly those with very large incomes and large reserves as well. The question I would have to two officers is, I'm not aware that we can set our own terms of reference in this committee, but rather we have passed them from elsewhere, so what would be the process for revising those terms of reference that we operate under Mr Evans Deontay?
comment on that, I think, is less terms of reference, isn't it, you mean the grant, the group the the grant criteria, so I mean I think ultimately it would be, it could be a recommendation from this committee.
I think its Finance Committee that are holding the overall sort of terms of reference in terms of grant criteria, so I think it'd be a paper through Finance Committee into the executives may change, I can check them out.
there is the committee saying we're asking officers to reconsider organisations with significant HRA reserves and LHA levels of income yeah yeah.
or Councillor Gruen.
and sometimes it's in it's in buildings, but it doesn't mean it isn't in hand, so I think there's a is a judgment there as regards to.
monies, so I think it is a judgment I mentioned that, of course there is a carer's house, you know they have a lot of money the day I say it wrongdoing.
Keith keys, house, you know there are some charities who do hold a lot of money yeah so I would like.
yeah yeah, Mr Murdoch, do you want to yes, I, the guidance notes in terms of?
there is there's a notice within the guidance notes that we know that this fund, because of the size of it it doesn't fund large capital projects and and we've debated over the years for what was a small and large mean.
I am sorry and I think we've taken capital projects that are not the total value might have been 30 40,000, no sorry and if you look back in some of the projects we have discussed tonight, another school, for example, in this one, knows that those projects are much more in excess of that, sorry generally, that scheme have looked through the NCL fund nor is as potential for funding for it there certainly were not within our who have never had.
any sort of limit in terms of the and organisation's income since the fund was established in 2014 15 and 10 that so it wasn't something which was considered at the time and and certainly hasn't been before.
Councillor Hedges, do you want to comment on you were right, this was on my list to ask you about, but given what Councillor Wirral saying, it goes against my original question, but I do have another one, a follow up one it could be because it looks as though we have actually awarded grants to this particular organisation before so.
yeah, I guess that goes against kind of what we're, but we've done in the past if we suddenly say we're not gonna give this organisation any more grants and in actual fact this looks at quite a are you not helping helping the disabled actually seems like choir quite a good cause as well, but sorry I know it goes against what you've just said and I do kind of see where you're coming from Councillor Warren come back.
on the two previous occasions, I also opposed.
I also queried a
I queried this.
and I think, going to IFCA every sympathy with there'd be wobbly saying about this, I'm not querying a large amount of money coming in if those large amounts of money is also being spent, because I think that's important that if you know if you're an organisation and you have an income of 1.3 million for your spending, the majorities on services, great that's what you actually, therefore, with and with this particular aspect, I look at the income and expenditure and obviously that's all we got on the paper, but it's 2 point. It's over 2 million that's actually unaccounted for in terms of expenditure, and I think that is considerable when you're asking to to pay for for the the works that are being asked for this, and I think that's where I am objecting to is if the income is is
that's coming in and the expenditure is so differential and and massive in this one, and that that's what I'm asking,
for some consideration around. I am very happy to take personally to go and discuss this with the Cabinet Member, and not him and Andrew, if the committee doesn't feel that they want to take this up formally yeah Councillor Waugh, I thought you and Councillor Hamilton were both both for pressing that we reviewed this but Councillor Hamilton to clarify, and then I think we need to move to a no no decision. I would just add, but I think I think I I fundamentally do agree that we should look at this structure again, I think be there'll be obviously this tonight's application is recommended for for refusal
I think it would make a lot of sense that, rather than us having a conversation
tonight, without having fully formed our thoughts about exactly what should qualify, what doesn't that, perhaps you know we do go back to the drawing board, potentially as Councillors have a conversation offline about this, about where we may wish to see changes?
and then, through Councillor Hedges on on our side, reach a position that I think of suitable suggestions from our side, I'm sure Labour will have your own recommendations to take forward to the Cabinet Member, and potentially they can form the basis of the assessment criteria in the in the future.
so let's not make a recommendation at this stage other than we agree with the officers not to go ahead with this, let's keep these discussions going, be very helpful if Councillor Hamilton and Councillor Warrell were to just discuss it, but you know from you for from both sides yeah thank you very much so that's number 29 not not agreed so number 30.
I can't pronounce this, can you help me, Ms Burgess, no doubt writers, scribblers, writers and scribblers it's okay is Rye recommended number 30.
greed?
31 is new art based project empowering children Wandsworth through the power of are not recommended.
greed?
the last one is 32 company programme and day skills workshops not recommended.
Greek
OK, thank you, we've got through them all.
thank you very much committee, I think thank you very much to the officers, too, for all the work in preparation and, say, sir, safe journey home, you'll be home in reasonable time goodnight everyone, thank you.